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Post by Unimog on Feb 15, 2008 8:46:50 GMT -7
In a Slot Forum thread discussing mandating a spec tire for club races, the following information was offered.
"If you are in the UK you will find that the majority of clubs ban the use of Silicone tyres because, for whatever reason, they destroy the grip for every other kind of tyre. Many clubs do allow the use of Ortmann tyres as these can be used with other types of tyre without causing major problems."
Should we consider banning silicones? I know they were also banned in Australian clubs when I entered a proxy race a couple years ago.
There seem to be just a few slot car components that have major influence on car performance - other mods are essentially tweaks. I believe tires are probably number one.
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Post by Unimog on Feb 15, 2008 9:04:29 GMT -7
This offered by Swissracer a moderator on Slot Forum.
"Silicones are banned in most clubs in Europe, my experience with them has always been bad. They pick up dust and loose traction fast, they polish the track and, yes indeed, they ruin the grip for rubber.
My understanding is that the printed tyres that come installed on Slot.It cars are not any P number at all but generic tyres fitted at the factory. That said they have got better in the last year or so and I run a Lancia on the original tyres on our wooden track, the grip is superb and far excels that of the P3 we use as standard. Here in Switzerland people swear by the P3 also for Scalextric Sport but I feel the P4 is better and look forward to trying the P6 soon.
If tyre choice is free in your club then Ortmanns are the ones to go with but they do leave dust and lower the grip for anyone not racing on them, your decision as to whether that is good or bad They also need truing before use most of the time.
NSR as stock are good overall but mostly need gluing to the rims and if you go the Italian way then you need a degree in Chemistry, lots of evil liquids, a truer and a tyre bath not to mention around 48 hours per pair! stupid if you ask me.
The other way to go is sponge, great all round tyres but they need more care and attention during their life than other tyres. For example, they work best with something like Tiger Milk or suntan lotion on them. Also when storing the car it is best to remove these tyres and store them in an air sealed tube such as a camera film tube. Overall these tyres also give grip to the track for all other types, sometimes too much! This builds up over time though."
MY COMMENT: Ortmann dust can be controlled by cleaning the tires (and car) before running.
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Post by DaveB on Feb 15, 2008 12:22:29 GMT -7
I'm not sure where this is going since I believe about 99 percent of the people in the club run silicone tires. I run both rubber and sillies on my track and never seemed to have a problem.
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Post by Unimog on Feb 15, 2008 16:31:41 GMT -7
Dave, I'm not sure it is really going anywhere. I thought it was interesting information. My "preferred tire" has, for quite a while, been NSR Ultra Grips. They are rubber. They can be difficult to find, do not last forever, and take some fiddling (NSR oil). I have found them to be "faster" than any other tire on Scalextric Sport track. Your's and Mark's are the only wood track I have run on. They did OK many moons ago on your track.
The thing this information brings up for me is that it looks like others using silicone tires probably precludes me from using rubber tires - so no NSRs. And, as you say, silicone tires are all the rage in the SSSCC.
From what I have read Ortmann tires are used in many club races in Europe. I think they re much more readily available in Europe than here. Professor Motor is the main shop that inventories them in the US. I doubt that anyone in SSSCC would be interested in making Ortmanns a spec tire. No problem for me with that.
I would be interested in what others think about some experimenting with mandating rubber tires for some club races. I know there are a few PPR diehards who would probably be agin' it.
What this info means to me, is that if anyone is running sillies, then it would likely be foolish for everyone not to run sillies. You have to keep them clean - probably partly because of the rubber they are taking off the track.
Also "rule" #4 is "post stuff on the board."
Maybe that basically means post info that others might be interested in. Most threads seem to shut down fairly quickly, so I'm thinking that meaningful discussion may not be a primary objective. If the board is basically to post info, then take this post as that. No real need to go anywhere with it.
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Post by Unimog on Feb 26, 2008 8:45:47 GMT -7
A recent post from an Australian member on the SCI forum:
"That's (referring to silicone tires removing rubber from the track)the reason most Aussie tracks don't allow silicone tires. Running only standard tires or aftermarket rubber ones will eventually lay some rubber down (as long as no-one cleans the track - vacuum cleaner is OK). Over time the track gets a nice grippy surface and it's probably one of the reasons our cars are heavier than yours."
I hadn't really thought about grip being related to weight. I've generally tried to keep cars light - to be nimble and accelerate quickly on straights. I have noticed, however, that a certain perennial SSSCC winner's cars corner much faster than any other driver's cars, but are not the quickest on the straight. Hmmmmmm. Driving style? Weight? I'm going to try a little experiment at the next race - see what percolates.
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Post by markdg on Feb 26, 2008 15:18:11 GMT -7
I hadn't really thought about grip being related to weight. I've generally tried to keep cars light - to be nimble and accelerate quickly on straights. I have noticed, however, that a certain perennial SSSCC winner's cars corner much faster than any other driver's cars, but are not the quickest on the straight. Hmmmmmm. Driving style? Weight? I'm going to try a little experiment at the next race - see what percolates. Well, we run 99.9% sillies, so there's no rubber to remove. Now do you want to be 1st into the corner but last coming out of it because you can't put the power down? We are all limited by a tiny contact patch and maximizing that is key to being fast everywhere. Too light and you can't put the power down, too light and you can't carry the speed through the corner. First add tires, drive it a bit and see how she reacts, then you add weight as needed and where needed. A bit in the front, a bit in the rear. Now, is your car stepping out in the back because of no weight? Too much weight? Where the weight is? Or the car is behaving that way because of how you are getting on or off the throttle? Many factors, many solutions, and all are compromises in one way or another. Trial and error my friends. And don't neglect your guide and how it sits in the slot...
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Post by Unimog on Feb 26, 2008 22:15:41 GMT -7
You're always so subtle in your descriptions, Sticky. Slobs? Horseshit? Puke? As the saying goes , "tell me what you really think." I suspect the way things are done in Europe and Australia are based on personal preferences and what tires are readily available. Your preferences are obviously different ;D. Thanks Mark for the primer. That's exactly what I'm going to try for the next race - more weight, more attention to the guide, and maybe change my driving style a little. And, of course, PPRs where I have them. We'll see. Will the RAID trucks have stock knobbies? Does anyone have a Schlesser?
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Post by Erick Von Maes on Feb 27, 2008 10:12:01 GMT -7
I have one craigo and IWILL BE RUNNING IT MARK
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Post by markdg on Feb 27, 2008 15:59:12 GMT -7
I have one Craigo and I WILL BE RUNNING IT MARK A buggy in a truck class? I guess I can run my Buggyra then...
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Post by jimn on Feb 27, 2008 17:16:53 GMT -7
Uni, One thing i have noticed about the oversea's boy's, is a lot of the posters are mag racers. Also Ortmann's are readily available for them more so than PPR's. So I am not so sure about there views on tyres anymore. But hey thats me. ;D buggy? Bugyra? You are both toast to my flour eminating Toureg!!!
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Post by DaveB on Feb 27, 2008 17:59:11 GMT -7
hey are the buggies (trucks) box stock???
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Post by markdg on Feb 27, 2008 23:10:05 GMT -7
hey are the buggies (trucks) box stock??? Yes, they are.
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Post by Unimog on Feb 28, 2008 9:27:26 GMT -7
I hadn't thought about the magnet thing, Sticky. Yuck.
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